Re: How to rework some French translations and contribute a Turkish translation?

classic Classic list List threaded Threaded
5 messages Options
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: How to rework some French translations and contribute a Turkish translation?

thraex
Hello,

I translated a few files into French and sent them to Mateusz (fdnpkg.fr,
fdpkg.fr, move.fr and xcopy.fr). After looking to these files, several questions
and remarks spring to my mind:

- I think providing a link to http://freedoslocal.sourceforge.net/ from
freedos.org would be a good idea, so that translators can find this page more
easily. Had I known about this page, I would have jumped in much earlier ;)

- On some of these files, I couldn't respect the 80 characters per line limit
compared to the English version especially for the help message of xcopy. Is
this a problem? If it is, what can I do? (French is kind of more verbose and the
same will also happen in compute.fr for instance)

- On some files, the translation is incomplete. But when I open the file in
French, there are no "empty lines". How do I add new sentences to translate to
these?

- FDNPKG.FR is in UTF8 but I couldn't convert it locally to ISO-8859-1. iconv
complains about an illegal character at position 0. Hope Mateusz will know what
to do with it.

- Also, I installed FreeDOS 1.2-rc1 in French in QEMU, and right after the
installation  when I type help the machine freezes. In English everything works
fine though. This looks like a bug to me, so I wanted to warn this list about
it.

Well, that's all for the moment. When I'm done with Freedoslocal, I'll start
working on the installer. Thanks for reading this.

-


---- Message d'origine ----
De : "Mateusz Viste" <[hidden email]>
À : [hidden email]
Objet : Re: [Freedos-devel] How to rework some French translations and contribute a Turkish translation?
Date : 04/11/2016 09:20:28 CET

Hi,

About translations of the installer - Jerome already provided an
extensive explanation.

About the rest of the system - I'd suggest taking a look here:
http://freedoslocal.sourceforge.net/

We actually already have partial Turkish translations provided by Ercan
Ersoy, you might want to synch with him to avoid double work.

Translations are simple text files. Encoding is UTF-8 when stored on the
freedoslocal project, there's an automated script that converts all
translations to proper 8bit codepages.

If you'd like to contribute some translations, send some first work to
me, I'd provide you with a svn access to freedoslocal then.

cheers,
Mateusz




------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Developer Access Program for Intel Xeon Phi Processors
Access to Intel Xeon Phi processor-based developer platforms.
With one year of Intel Parallel Studio XE.
Training and support from Colfax.
Order your platform today. http://sdm.link/xeonphi
_______________________________________________
Freedos-devel mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-devel
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: How to rework some French translations and contribute a Turkish translation?

Paul Dufresne
> - FDNPKG.FR is in UTF8 but I couldn't convert it locally to ISO-8859-1.
> iconv
> complains about an illegal character at position 0. Hope Mateusz will know
> what
> to do with it.
Well, it is supposed to be CP437, as far as I can tell.
Which is not ISO-8859-1 nor UTF8.
Here I try to look at it in ISO-8859-1 or UTF-8 and it does not show
correct in any
of these. My browser does not seems to support CP437.


I think I had done it from within edit in DOS to have it correct.

I do care about help not working in french (but works in english).
Not sure I have the knowledge and/or time to investigate it.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Developer Access Program for Intel Xeon Phi Processors
Access to Intel Xeon Phi processor-based developer platforms.
With one year of Intel Parallel Studio XE.
Training and support from Colfax.
Order your platform today. http://sdm.link/xeonphi
_______________________________________________
Freedos-devel mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-devel
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: How to rework some French translations and contribute a Turkish translation?

Paul Dufresne
Oops, FDNPKG.FR you said. I was confusing with the installer, sorry.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Developer Access Program for Intel Xeon Phi Processors
Access to Intel Xeon Phi processor-based developer platforms.
With one year of Intel Parallel Studio XE.
Training and support from Colfax.
Order your platform today. http://sdm.link/xeonphi
_______________________________________________
Freedos-devel mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-devel
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: How to rework some French translations and contribute a Turkish translation?

Mateusz Viste-4
In reply to this post by thraex
On 05/11/2016 15:23, [hidden email] wrote:
> I translated a few files into French and sent them to Mateusz (fdnpkg.fr,
> fdpkg.fr, move.fr and xcopy.fr). After looking to these files, several
> questions
> and remarks spring to my mind:

Looks good, but I see that there are lines that wraps on the screen,
which looks very bad (words are splitted in half), and it can make the
help screens longer than the author expected, leading for eg. to being
unable to fit on a single screen. More on that below.

> - On some of these files, I couldn't respect the 80 characters per line
> limit compared to the English version especially for the help message of
> xcopy. Is this a problem? If it is, what can I do? (French is kind of more verbose
> and the same will also happen in compute.fr for instance)

As said above, yes, it's quite bothering.

Can you please review your translations to make sure the length of the
translations is respected? It's not always easy, but that's part of the
translation job :) Do not target an exact literal translation - a
shorter, slightly uglier one is often better if it fits in the same
space as the original and still conveys the same technical information
in an understandable way.

Example:

Original (79 chars): Use common notation used on computers. Powers can
be specified by "^" operator.

Your version (119 chars): Utilisez la notation commune utilisée sur les
ordinateurs. Les puissances peuvent être spécifiées par l'opérateur "^".

My suggestion (79 chars): La notation est usuelle pour ordinateurs.
Puissances possibles avec l'op. "^".

> - On some files, the translation is incomplete. But when I open the file in
> French, there are no "empty lines". How do I add new sentences to
> translate to these?

This happens when the translation file is older than the original. In
such cases, you need to re-compare (manually) both files, and add the
missing original strings into the translated version. Note, that
sometimes strings can disappear from one version to another, so in case
of outdated files you should also take care of removing the translated
strings that do not appear anymore in the original.

> - FDNPKG.FR is in UTF8 but I couldn't convert it locally to ISO-8859-1.
> iconv complains about an illegal character at position 0. Hope Mateusz will
> know what to do with it.

I checked it, and it's simply because your UTF-8 translation contains a
BOM. You can easily check that with a hex editor - the first 3 bytes of
the file are set to 0xEF 0xBB 0xBF. These characters are not displayed
by your text editor, which is why you might have been confused. It's
usually possible to configure the text editor to stop adding this
useless header. But you can also leave it as is, and use utf8tocp for
conversions, as it will strip any BOMs automatically:
http://utf8tocp.sourceforge.net
In any case, the translations need to be stored within the freedoslocal
project as UTF-8. The only reason you'd want to convert them yourself is
if you wish to test them on an actual FreeDOS system (highly recommended).

Finally, please note that FreeDOS uses CP850 (aka 'Latin 1') for French
localizations, not ISO-8859-1.

cheers,
Mateusz



> ---- Message d'origine ----
> De : "Mateusz Viste" <[hidden email]>
> À : [hidden email]
> Objet : Re: [Freedos-devel] How to rework some French translations and
> contribute a Turkish translation?
> Date : 04/11/2016 09:20:28 CET
>
> Hi,
>
> About translations of the installer - Jerome already provided an
> extensive explanation.
>
> About the rest of the system - I'd suggest taking a look here:
> http://freedoslocal.sourceforge.net/
>
> We actually already have partial Turkish translations provided by Ercan
> Ersoy, you might want to synch with him to avoid double work.
>
> Translations are simple text files. Encoding is UTF-8 when stored on the
> freedoslocal project, there's an automated script that converts all
> translations to proper 8bit codepages.
>
> If you'd like to contribute some translations, send some first work to
> me, I'd provide you with a svn access to freedoslocal then.
>
> cheers,
> Mateusz
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Developer Access Program for Intel Xeon Phi Processors
> Access to Intel Xeon Phi processor-based developer platforms.
> With one year of Intel Parallel Studio XE.
> Training and support from Colfax.
> Order your platform today. http://sdm.link/xeonphi
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Freedos-devel mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-devel
>



------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Developer Access Program for Intel Xeon Phi Processors
Access to Intel Xeon Phi processor-based developer platforms.
With one year of Intel Parallel Studio XE.
Training and support from Colfax.
Order your platform today. http://sdm.link/xeonphi
_______________________________________________
Freedos-devel mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-devel
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: How to rework some French translations and contribute a Turkish translation?

thraex
In reply to this post by thraex


Hi,

I worked a little bit on the French installer and translated it in Turkish. Mateusz's utf8tocp tool was really helpful to get the French file into utf8 :) I uploaded a tarball at <http://s000.tinyupload.com/?file_id=26330290422109269122>, you can find these files both in UTF8 and in code page format. I hope it's not too late to get the Turkish version included in the next RC so that they can be tested by users and get included in the next stable release.

It would also be nice to include the Turkish installer because soon (in a few days) the Turkish translation at http://freedoslocal.sourceforge.net/ will be done at 100% (only freecom_lng left), and, last but not least, because many computer manufacturers sell computers with FreeDOS installed in Turkey so that users don't have to pay for Windows.

If, as I hope, Turkish is included, it would be necessary to add two more keyboard layouts to the installer: Turkish F (more information on <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Latin-script_non-QWERTY_keyboards#Turkish_.28F-keyboard.29> and Turkish QWERTY (more information on <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/QWERTY#Turkish_.28Q-keyboard.29>).

Thanks for reading this and needless to say, feel free to yell at me if I can do something more (or if I did something wrong).


---- Message d'origine ----
De : "Jerome E. Shidel Jr." <[hidden email]>
À : "Technical discussion and questions for FreeDOS developers." <[hidden email]>
Objet : Re: [Freedos-devel] How to rework some French translations and contribute a Turkish translation?
Date : 04/11/2016 01:33:34 CET



(...)
The installer is pure batch file logic that uses external utilities. Mostly, powered by FreeCOM and V8 Power Tools,

The language files are text resource files that include some variables and formatting switches. Some of the embedded comments in those files are a little outdated. But, take a look at https://github.com/shidel/FDI/blob/master/LANGUAGE/EN/FDSETUP.DEF and https://github.com/shidel/FDI/blob/master/LANGUAGE/FR/FDSETUP.DEF
They are a little complicated to read. But, not to bad once you get the hang of them. At present, only standard the Standard DOS latin character set is supported. Both UNIX (LF) and Windows (CRLF) line endings are supported.

The best way to work on a language is by installing FreeDOS into DOSBox, downloading the github sources and using the TestLang.bat utility. But, that is kind of complex to get setup correctly. I really need to work on the wiki and manual for the installer. :-(





------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Developer Access Program for Intel Xeon Phi Processors
Access to Intel Xeon Phi processor-based developer platforms.
With one year of Intel Parallel Studio XE.
Training and support from Colfax.
Order your platform today. http://sdm.link/xeonphi
_______________________________________________
Freedos-devel mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/freedos-devel